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Animation Artist, creator of over 100 pieces of Flash animation on and offline. Graduate of the School of Visual Arts, Class of 2011.

Chris Niosi @Kirbopher

31, Male

Animation Artist

School of Visual Arts

New York

Joined on 7/21/04

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So, There Was This One Time... + Dark Indulgence

Posted by Kirbopher - November 17th, 2008

"So, there was this one time...when a Bat, a Rhino, a Ferret and an old man...all got together and played a card game."

"There Was This One Time" has been fully storyboarded and most of the dialogue, voiced by the talented likes of TeamFourStar, has been recorded so that I can start cutting the audio together. "THAT MONGOOSE!!" was also kind enough to provide musical arrangement for the BGM, which was awesome. I can't wait to start working on this cartoon, though this one will require patience. I'll be doing an animatic for it by the end of 2008 and will be working on the actual animation up until when it's due at the end of the school year in late April-early May. Either case, I hope this one will impress some of my peers who're used to a lot of the same typical crap from me. There's a higher chance of it NOT impressing anyone, but since it's a school project anyway, I have "nothing to lose" in that respect. It's been really fun putting this together, even at such an early stage. If anything, this probably won't even get front page, which I'm actually fine with.

Other news, been taking a slight break from any Rangers work, but I'll be getting back to it and hopefully getting a lot done over Christmas vacation. The beginning of "Part 2" is actually one of my favorite scenes in the movie. $00pah NiN10Doh!'s still coming along; I'm waiting for about four more segments, two of which are long enough to be spread across the movie and the other two are very detailed in animation. Richie did some sexilicious menu design, but the actionscript can't quite be worked on until I get everything else that I need, so I'm back to playin' the waiting game a little.


So I'm curious on others' thoughts on I guess what would be considered two types of "indulgence"...as "bad" as they can get on a community as small-scale as a bunch of people on the internet doing flash animation. Specifically: Fandom & Money.

I've grown to be bitter towards fandom and what it represents in all aspects, through a bunch of different things. People, for whatever reason, seem to have this idea that "ever since [I] got a fanbase" of some kind that now suddenly I think I'm "hot shit", when the reality is I hate the very concept of a fanbase for anything. Anime fans in particular will be familiar with how often an annoying fanbase for a good show, or at least a half-decent show that gets more flack than it may deserve, will completely "ruin" the experience for them. For myself, I try to NOT let factors such as that destroy the enjoyment I get out of something, despite it being REALLY difficult in some cases...and that in itself proves the point of it being something that spoils the enjoyment. People seem to have a low tolerance for that and soon the fun is dead.

Yet, this applies much differently to "the little guys" like all of us on Newgrounds who submit cartoons. Thanks to the magical interbutt, ANYONE can garner people who enjoy what they do, because now a billion people can see it. Outside of just flash animation, friends of mine who create other mediums such as video parodies, after gaining some amount of success, will bring up "their fans" as a factor of some kind, positively or negatively depending on the subject. When I met Erin Fitzgerald at SDCC, she described Danny Antonucci creating Ed, Edd & Eddy COMPLETELY for himself. The cast will often suggest such-and-such ideas to give something to the fans, but his mentality is that, for instance, if all of the VAs were to come back and do another season of the show for Cartoon Network, it would be because he genuinely WANTS to do it and for no other reason. Period. A lot of people would consider this an "assholish" thing to do, but at the same time, it's respectable.

Everyone seems to assume that when you "get a fanbase", your head swells to the size of a fucking planet and suddenly it becomes all about that and that alone. For those who see past this and disregard fandom as a big deal, what's the next not-so-good thing that becomes a motive? Deniro.

Now THIS one coming from me is obviously going to look extremely hypocritical, so bear with me. EmRat made a VERY good point to me that I agreed with whole-heartedly...yet I have no ROOM to agree with it. That being, outright parody cartoons shouldn't be eligable for cash prizes or sponsorships, if anything the purely original animation works of people on NG should be the ones in the limelight for that. Thankfully, this goes both ways anyhow since some of the best purely original flashes on here have gotten their dues. However, since this applies to me too, a ton of the NON-original stuff brings people to NG front page because of their pure "dumb" entertainment value, like Parody Rangers and what not. Logically it makes sense, but it's also not entirely fair either.

But despite how I agree with it, again, I have no room to say anything because I AM one of those people getting paid for making parody cartoons and am locked into finishing them until probably next Summer. I can comfort myself with my future original projects, plus that WHAT I'm using the "earnings" for what I'd consider just causes like paying for tuition and funding original cartoons instead of doing crap like Rangers until the end of time...but I can't help but be bothered by it. I think a lot of people on NG from all over the spectrum may have thought about this at some point. A lot of people I've spoken to hate how it's become, if not about a fanbase, the possibly more so about the money. Then at the same time, a few OTHER people I've spoken to about this; people who generally look down upon things like video game parodies, have even told me outright that if they were in my position, offered a good sum of dough to produce a "crappy" unoriginal movie, they wouldn't pass it up in a million years.

The biggest instance where that hit me was when I had gotten an idea a month ago or so, JUST an idea mind you, of making a "TTA OVA" that was essentially the first three episodes of my old TTA series, redone, fully animated and voice acted, much better dialogue and overall concepts, almost like as if it were a pilot episode (since I think in SOME aspects TTA could be done as a real cartoon, but I don't see myself doing it). The problem is, it would be a TON of work to do for an unseeable amount of time and probably wouldn't be sponsorship-worthy, so with no "profit" to come of it, it's a project that wouldn't be worth doing, no matter how much fun it would be...and that's just it. The fact that now "profit" HAS become something important to me is actually a bit unsettling. It's like I can't have outright fun with doing a cartoon no matter what the case. Do a parody and you get looked down upon, do an original cartoon and you'll feel creatively satisfied, but will be taking risks with it after all of your hard work.

Even with GameSavers as a project I'm looking forward to the most, I'm still even taking a risk with that. Like what if I DO end up producing a full pilot that I work on for a full year with everyone on board, it ends up being really impressive...but nothing comes of it? Since it's such a long way's off, I can't worry about it for now, but it's still something worth considering.

For any of you guys who've ever wondered about these two specific things, or even had any experiences such as this or otherwise, please let me know your thoughts here.

Comments (25)

Not going to denounce Brawl Taunts in this one too? Heh, I guess you've defended your case enough times.

Yeah, figured people are BEYOND tired of that by this point. That, and Parody Rangers is more along the lines of the point I was trying to illustrate since it's essentially all my own doing in contrast to B.T.

I like you, sir, even if I do not like what you make.

Hooray for use of logic! :]

I think it would be one thing if you only started doing parody rangers in the first place just solely for the money, but if you did that I probably wouldn't enjoy it as much since you wouldn't of had fun making it.

If you redid the first 3 episodes of TTA that would be awesome but I do see why you wouldn't do it. I mean you got school and all that other crap in your life and you have to make money somehow and animating is a way you do it because your quite good at it and I respect that. Still would be awesome if you did it but I don't believe it will ever happen but im still kinda glad to hear that you wanted to do it. It just seemed to me that you where so tired of TTA that you hated it.

No, actually a friend made the suggestion of getting the Rangers Movie sponsored and I rolled with it. Then $00pah NiN10Doh! getting sponsored was an offer, actually.

I hate some of the things that spawned from TTA, but I don't hate the series. I simply accept it for what it is and the level I was at when I made it.

You know, you really did hit the nail spot-on regarding fandom and the total bullshit that can result from it. In that respect, I usually cite what's happened to the Final Fantasy series. Mind you, that's the fandom problem taken to an obscene degree that made me want to puke the first time I saw it in all its unholy glory, but I believe it still serves as an example. My opinion is usually "FUCK the fans". You try to please those man-eating fuckwads, you're liable to turn into a zombie slave to the wants of others.

As for the money issue, I personally haven't really paid much attention to it, so I can't offer much in the way of thoughts on that aspect. What I can suggest is that you do what you WANT to do, while tying it in with a cash supply. Maybe by submitting your original creations to Flash animation festivals across the country, and living off those profits and merchandising. Just because fans are a goddamn nuisance doesn't mean you can't profit off of them. And Christ forbid we all forget the fact that Monthly Winners here on Newgrounds ALSO gain wonderful cash prizes! SRSLY. Think about it.

Live to animate, or animate to live. Your choice, or both.

Technically its illegal for Tom to give money out to any flash cartoon that contains any form of copyrighted material, whether it be characters, music or story. Even tho alot of people will claim that its not under the law of parody, the parody laws themselves dont make making money of characters themselves legal.

Also you think too much, its not healthy :P

I agree with your views on fanbases, I have a freind who enjoys making youtube videos in his spare time. These videos are all under 1,000 views and practically unknown but he does much more creative stuff then all of the well known youtube channels. The truth is that if somebody finds a sucessful formula they will continue doing the same thing to please fans/make profit.

Anyways good luck with your work.

Yeah, I'm on the same line as MRat.

All people have to do is look from the other person's perspective and see how they would feel. I've started to do that a while ago, and it has made me an overall better person.

But if you enjoy your work doesnt that make up for all the other crap?

Eh, that's become a bit debatable as of late. It may be a while before I can truly feel that way again, genuinely.

It's a terrible thing, that all animation must be eventually sieved into either "For me", or "For money". It's a sad realization when you realize that it isn't always possible to get paid for something you love to do, or if you can, realize the work to profit ratio just isn't enough.

Corruption started with a single seed of greed.

The above is a fact of life. Cash businesses like restaurants almost always hide their money, because insurance and taxes make thieves out of businessmen. A single person would hide some of his profit, and the another liked the idea. Soon, taxes had to be raised to make up for the "lack of income". Then others had to hide THEIR money, so they could have enough. The cycle continues even today, all started by a single seed of greed.

Money is a corrupt thing, but a necessity as well. The problem built upon itself until it was unstoppable. Eventually, all work is succumb to the need of money, as all others who deny this truth will taunt and abandon, until they too realize this fact, as those of their generation will succumb to the same taunting.

Money is a monster, and consumes all eventually.


I'm a banana I'm healthier than you.

Ok so the work your doing is different then other things i have seen...BUT ITS TOTALLY AWSOME my brother says your work is shit.

I think all of your new up and coming original projects are great...
just keep doing what you love!

Can't wait to see So there was this one time just to see who's voiceign who (though I have a very good feeling).

Maybe its just me being a writer and not an animator, but I can see where your not influenced by your fans but money? I might not understand what you're going through, paying for college and making your hobby your career, but to me, money comes to me as a bonus, not a motivator. Though I myself on forums have complained (always do) about animators with no ideas asking for all the money we might make, If it came down to it being a deciding point, money means nothing to me in forms of writing.

My motivation comes from sharing my ideas with people who will most likely hate them (yet I still try). Than again I hear animators take months to make projects (or it least make them worth watching). I don't understand why money makes all the difference if you truly believe yoru ideas are worth viewing.

But hey, I have nothing to back up my case (only two badly drawn youtubes that parody things, which I just made to have something on there), while you have all your parodies, voice acting, and your orginal works to prove you know what your doing. I just saying my opinion, whether it valild or not. (Seeing as I complain a lot, I don't think it matters

Good luck with your projects. Sorry for wasting alot of post space with my comment but its something I need to say. When I see Gamesavers I'll give it a high grade

originallity MUST be rewarded period

Well, it SHOULD be. It doesn't always neccasarily happen, which irritates me, but it should happen more often.

1. Three Animals Plus an Old Guy looks... interesting. I guess I can't tell yet, we'll have to wait. Hope it's good.

2. I can't wait for Parody Rangers 2. It'll be hilarious! If you can, please make it into one piece this time. Unless it takes to much time and it's annoying you. It's your choice, but I (that's me, someone no one cares about) prefer if you could.

3. Same for $00pah Nin10Doh! I can't wait, I hope Richie is doing another fun cartoon. He's so funny!

4. I would read all that, but I don't have enough time. Although I did see that TTA pic and hoped for another season, but... "THERE IS NO SEASON 4"

Yeah Richie did another segment for the collab. Dunno what the reaction to it'll be, though...we'll see XD;

Honestly I would say just go read the rest if you get the chance, and also look back on the other entries for reason as to why making them into one part is kinda difficult. I'm still trying though.

Hard work will be rewarded. (well, hopefully.)

I did a bit of an experiment concerning the sad state of what gets popular these days.

I made a flash animation called "SRM The FPS" which is kind of general humor on first person shooters. Well, nobody saw it, and it got a 3.6 rating or so. I deleted it and resubmitted it under the name "SRM Call of Duty 4" and lo and behold, it got daily 4th and a 4.20 score.

I absolutely despise that in order to be anything resembling successful on this website, you have to directly parody something obscenely successful. I made a cartoon that's halfway between a Fallout 3 parody and a completely original toon and submitted it yesterday and it did alright. However, if "Fallout 3" was not in the title, I can guarantee that noone here would ever see it.

It's these pandering reasons why I don't think I'll ever make SRM Transformers 4. Sure, I could make it and it would automatically be a hit like the last 3 (my only toons to get front page) but I know I would not enjoy it; nor would it be my best work.

I'm really happy to hear that you're making something completely original though. I loved your Parody Rangers toons and Brawl Taunts, but I really would like to see what you can do without the crutch of parody to rest on. I know every time I try to branch out and do something original, nobody sees it. Hopefully your toon won't have the same fate, but I'm looking forward to it immensely.

Similarly lamenting the state of Newgrounds
- Campbell McLaughlin (battosai810)

Hey thanks very much!

lawl when i saw this i lawl kirb reminided me of totatly kyle xD anyways yep looks like your stuff is going along well ~ some random fan xD

if u make another brawl taunts flash add roy complaining hes not in brawl and then gets K.Oed by ike the rest is ure idea

I didn't write either of them.

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